006_Sven Mayer: Is Parawinging possible for riders over 100kgs???

Season #1 April 07, 2025

Sven Mayer is an early adopter of Parawinging being one of the first foilers to gain access to both the BRM and the FLOW. Sveny shares his experience with both brands, the pros and cons of each parawing, as well as the struggles and advantages of heavy riders (100kg+) entering the sport. We talk about board design and foil choices for the heavier riders and Sveny gives heaps of tips and tricks for the taller/ heavier riders entering the sport. Is parawinging really doable if you’re 100kgs and over? What gear is the best for riders over 100kgs? Can heavier riders ride sinker boards? Have a listen to find out!

Don’t forget to subscribe for more foiling tutorials, down winding tips, and parawing techniques to elevate your water sports skills. Leave a comment or question below, and share your own experiences with foiling in the open ocean! Enjoy the vibes!

Keep the comments coming as it helped me heaps from the first video!

@foilrat on Instagram

#Parawinging #Parawing #Foiling #DownWinding #Winging

Episode Transcript

Daniel Paronetto (00:11)
to the Lab Rat Foiler podcast. My name is Dan, I'm your host and today we have Sven Mayer, Svenny Foils on Instagram. How are you mate?

Sven Mayer (00:20)
Pretty good, can't complain. Yeah, pretty much now. We are pretty good at the lately. We lots of seaweed the last few weeks, but there some days there pretty good. Like yesterday was sick, weekend was not too bad. yeah, getting out pretty.

Daniel Paronetto (00:22)
Can't complain. Have you been getting out much? I see you posting things every day.

Nice, nice. Venny,

you've been frothing on the para-wing like I have frothing on the para-wing. We're just kind of obsessed with it right now. This podcast is all about experiencing new things and being the lab rat for the foiling experiments, so trying new things. that's what we're gonna dive into and we're gonna be talking a lot about para-winging. But before we start, I always love to hear Foiler's backgrounds. When did you start?

Sven Mayer (00:48)
Thank you.

Yeah, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (01:07)
foiling, how did you start foiling? What was your first foiling discipline? And then we'll go from there.

Sven Mayer (01:14)
I started foiling with the kite actually because I was kite surfing because kite surfing I was normal surfing then I thought I need something for summertime when the wind is coming so I started kite surfing then I made of my actually we started dock starting a little bit as well before kite foiling and then kite foiling and then prone foiling actually that was like the start

Daniel Paronetto (01:38)
How was the doc starts?

I found it so hard to...

Sven Mayer (01:40)
It

was really hard. We had an old Nash setup and it was like, yeah, it just made it like 10 meters. It was not really working because the foils are way too small. like, it was like, But that was actually the first thing getting introduced to a foil. And then I thought, okay, cool. We can use it on the kite and we can go kite foiling a little bit. And then straight away I started prone and then behind the ski, because I have a jet ski and we went straight away towing. That was actually the, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (01:48)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, that'll give you lot of time on foil and yeah.

Well, how did you find the transition from kite foiling to prone? I did kind of the same thing and I found it so hard to prone.

Sven Mayer (02:17)
Yeah, it was really hard. I have a surfing background. I'm from Germany, but I've not much surfing. I started surfing when I was 21, think the first time in France. And then when I moved over to Australia, I did it every day actually. But yeah, I found it really hard because the foot pressure is way different than for surfing. So yeah, it was really hard. also I kite foiling is one of the easiest to get into foiling because

Daniel Paronetto (02:26)
Mm-hmm.

Mm, mm.

Sven Mayer (02:47)
it pulls you up and it's really easy. I almost think it's easier than behind the ski because you have this pull upwards so you can get straight on the foil and can try and get the balance right or something like that. it's definitely easier than wing foiling or something like that. what I think.

Daniel Paronetto (02:53)
Mm-hmm.

Really easier than wing foiling. That's interesting. I find...

Sven Mayer (03:05)
That's what I think kite

foiling. I started kite foiling, then prone, then towing, and then pretty late wing foiling actually. I found it not hard, but was different. I was windsurfing when I was a kid, but it was different to kite foiling or something like that.

Daniel Paronetto (03:15)
Mm. Mm.

And what brought you to Australia? You had said you were from Germany. What brought you to Perth?

Sven Mayer (03:37)
We actually did a world travel 2011 or 2010 and then stopped in Western Australia to get some work, get some money and then we decided to stay here. Now we travelled around Australia and then we decided to go to Perth.

Daniel Paronetto (03:53)
didn't leave. It's not a bad place. Perfect place for foiling as well.

Sven Mayer (04:03)
the thing we want to stay because it's a little bit behind. So sometimes I think I'm coming from the future. that's why it's really quiet. And yeah, it's pretty cool. yeah, yeah. That's pretty good.

Daniel Paronetto (04:10)
Yeah.

So now parowinging.

When did you see the parawing for the first time?

Sven Mayer (04:23)
I think the first time I saw the pocket wing or I saw something, I don't know, it must be almost two years ago because then I spoke to a mate of mine and said, hey, let's go get some trainer kites and stuff like that. And we ordered one actually like a one from AliExpress, but it never worked. But yeah, it must be two years. And I think it was one of the pocket kites when I saw the first time.

Daniel Paronetto (04:29)
Mmm.

Yep.

I did the same thing.

Yep.

Sven Mayer (04:50)
And then at the moment I saw the first BRM on their launched day I was the first guy to put my order in it. Because I saw it, man, you can go a little bit upwind because the problem is the trainer kind of says there was no power at all. And I tried also like converting a peak. I tried that and it didn't, there's no, there's a little bit pull forward, but nothing for me, this 110 kilos, it's like there was nothing at all. was like, it was like, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (04:54)
Hmm.

Yep.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

Sven Mayer (05:18)
And then I said, shit, this BIM looks weird.

Daniel Paronetto (05:19)
was I had a very similar journey. I think

It was yeah, look Greg nailed that first Iteration of it because I was kind of like you I saw the pocket wing and it was so close to like what we needed to jump on it and then when I saw the upwind angles of the guys in Maui I I think you and I were probably in that first batch because I saw five minute of video and I'm like I'm gonna buy it I bought it. I'm like, that's it

Sven Mayer (05:31)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was. was with another guy here. We were ordered to be able to get first guys in WI to get the BIMs. They like that. It was really.

Daniel Paronetto (05:54)
So what about,

I find it so interesting because the pocket wing was probably 95 % there. What about the BRM? Was it just the upwind angle or what was it that actually said, I need this?

Sven Mayer (06:04)
The upwind

anchor and all, when I saw the pocket wing it was all over the place. I tried it after I had my BIM, a guy here had got a pocket wing and I tried it and it felt like, you see, I saw the video from the pocket wing with the two handles and I wasn't sold on that. It looked really hard and not like, I wanted, because I started downwind paddling when I have pretty bad back, like bad, like dislocated this and it was really bad for my back. So.

Daniel Paronetto (06:19)
Yep. Yep.

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (06:33)
I just got into it. I got up, but it was really hard on my body. I said, shit, can't do it because I need something. That's why I thought that this powering would be pretty cool. But when I saw the videos from the pocket, it looked cool, but it looked hard. It looked really hard. It looked like really hard on your body as well. I said, oh, I'm not sure. And at the moment I saw the video from behind from Greg and I said, I'm 100 % sure that works. And it looks like doable.

Daniel Paronetto (06:47)
Mmm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (07:00)
and looks like not easier, but it looks like not that hard on my body on the lower back and things like that. that straight away like, yeah, that's the one because the upwind angle, I'm not into this upwind thing because I'm not normally going upwind. I normally need the wing, get out of the water, shoot out 500 meters, maybe a K, pack it away and go. And normally I don't need it then for the next five, 10 kilometers. If the bottom's so good, I don't, never need it. But only I hit seaweed or something like that. But otherwise, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (07:06)
Yep.

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (07:30)
I only needed to get up, get out and that's it. I don't do this up, not the upwind thing. I have to try it more, but I still prefer going upwind. You have some good swell up a little bit north where I normally winging and I still prefer going on the wing there. Because I still, the wing, yeah, maybe I'm not that good at the moment to do all the power wing like the upwind game because I'm...

Daniel Paronetto (07:33)
love it.

Really? That's interesting. So you're taking the... Wow.

Sven Mayer (07:57)
I still drift too much downwind and I found it really hard to go upwind. That spot is like you have only like a little gap. If you're drifting too far downwind, you're hitting, coming to the next reef and sit on the reef. And then there's an island coming and you're fucked. It's like you have a long swim and it's it's not that fun. So you have to get really, get up all the time and yeah, not drifting too much. And I always make one mistake. I always use way too small foils.

Daniel Paronetto (08:03)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

You're done. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, we always want to do that, right? We're like, no, I'm ready for it. I'm ready for it. Yeah.

Sven Mayer (08:25)
in my whole journey. Yeah,

I just found it out like the last two months, Mr. Parving, I went big for when I started, then yeah, and then straight away small, small, small, small. And now I'm going big, big, big because it's way easier and it's still because I'm so anyway, I'm tall, I'm heavy. I can turn like a big 1300, 1400, 1500 even I can still turn it and can make it like fun. Yeah, so yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (08:49)
Mmm.

Sven Mayer (08:54)
But that's what I always do like doing, like...

Daniel Paronetto (08:55)
Yeah, that's interesting.

We don't, we don't have too many people power winging with your weight and your height, which are two things that are pretty hard to, to manage and find gear for what, when you saw the light you got, I need the BRM. What BRM sizes did you buy?

Sven Mayer (09:11)
I bought straight away the 5 because I thought otherwise I spoke to Greg and he said yeah normally your wing size and I started when I was winging with a 5 and a 6 so thought okay I'm getting a 5 and at the moment I'm winging only when I'm winging now I'm having a 4.5 that's my only wing normally I had a 4, 5 and 6 but now I have a 4.5 and I can use that anytime from like 14, 13, 14 knots I can use it but I'm good at it

I know how works and that works but I thought on a powering I'd definitely a 5 and a big one. And I got my 5 and two months later I said, should I need a 6 for lighter weight? I bought a 6. I bought a 6 as well. I had a BRM 5 and a 6. Yeah I used it. I kind of often used it. Because I started...

Daniel Paronetto (09:50)
Yeah, did you- then you bought the what's the- the-

did you even use the six?

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (10:05)
Like when I started powering, I started with the 5 and I started with my long, I had this Axis downwind board 8'6", I think so was it, 130 liters. That's what I started and I had a smick downwind board as well, but I tried as well. That was actually my first go, so no, the first three, four goes going on the powering. And then say, oh, that's cool, but that's not what I would do. I want to have small boards, that's why.

Daniel Paronetto (10:29)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (10:34)
Otherwise I can pedal I thought. And then straight away, then to smaller boards. And if you need to go smaller boards, you need bigger wings, like bigger power wings or bigger foils or something like that. yeah, that's us.

Daniel Paronetto (10:37)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

What was the,

what was the step down from that downwind aboard? went from the 86, 130 liters to what board?

Sven Mayer (10:54)
I went down, I

a Acaba, a custom-made son of a Acaba, 80 liters. It was a 6.2, but it was custom-made. It was way flatter, not much rocker, and not that thick. That's the production one. What I used also for winging and like light wind winging, it has 79 liters, 80 liters, and it got flying pretty easy. That's what was the step down. It was definitely a small boat, but it...

Daniel Paronetto (11:17)
Yeah, it's still a small board for 110 liters.

Sven Mayer (11:23)
That worked really well for it, definitely. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (11:26)
Sorry, 110 kilos, not 110 liters. Yeah. It's still,

well, it's still under like I, my mid length, um, is a one-to-one weight to volume ratio. So 85 liters and I'm probably 82, 85 with all the gear. And yeah, I find that a very easy board to get up. get up pretty much anytime, but anything under your weight starts to get a little tricky.

Sven Mayer (11:38)
Yeah. Yeah.

That's definitely tricky. why I'm always getting... That's what I thought. I get better or bigger power wing because I'm only needing it to get up. I'm not going back and forward. So then I don't care if it pulls me out and it's really hard on my hands for the first two minutes and then I'll take it away. But I get up straight away. That's I said, okay, I'm buying a six as well because it's the five. I could go on the Sanova around... Yeah, so still it's like green arrows, like 80, 90 knots.

Daniel Paronetto (12:04)
Mmm.

Sven Mayer (12:17)
on the Sonova ball, but it was still like a challenge. It depends on the swell. If there's a lot of west swell, when you go against the swell to get up, have to wind swell and the ground swell and you're going against the swell, it was pretty hard to get it up. And at that time I also used smaller foils as well. And I figured that out. The first that was so big was the 1180. The Spitfire 1180 was the first one.

Daniel Paronetto (12:19)
No, I don't.

Mmm.

Yeah. What was the first foil that you tried, the Parawing one?

Yeah, nice.

Sven Mayer (12:46)
And then straight away I went down to the Triple Nine V2 and it's way too small. if it's honking it's pretty good but it takes a lot to getting it up. yeah, I use very different stuff at the moment because it's like, yeah, it makes it easier and way more fun, way more fun. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (12:54)
yet.

Yeah.

Do you find

that when you put a bigger foil on, you're a little bit slower than the wind swell and the ground swell? Like, do you find that going downwind, you're a little bit like not coordinated with the speed?

Sven Mayer (13:14)
Nah, that's

funny because I'm so heavy and I've spoke to so many people and they're always like, especially talking about the 1180 Spitfire, everybody's saying, that's the new 1300 V2 from, they're really slow foils, everybody driving a tractor or whatever. But the 1180, I got on the 1180, the best pace was under two minutes and 30, two minutes, 28 on 1180. It's insane.

Daniel Paronetto (13:26)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Wow, nice,

that's good pace. Yeah.

Sven Mayer (13:40)
But I think

because I'm 110 kilos, that's the advantage. The first time I have some advantage when you're heavy, you can go way faster. You get bigger foils faster and you have not that much drag, think. I did yesterday a run on the 1300 and I can actually overtake. It was not much wind. was like 16, 17 knots. And I overtake bumps.

Daniel Paronetto (13:52)
Mmm.

Yeah?

Yeah, nice. So you're going up and over. And I think it's cool for you to give people this information because there's so many guys now getting into it here and they are over 90 kilos. And sometimes, know, even if they're just tall, like it's such a different dynamic and the foils will react so differently. So you're saying that even a 1300, you can still, still go.

Sven Mayer (14:25)
Definitely, if you're heavy, definitely

still go. And then if you're 90 kilos, I think you definitely need a smaller power wing, because especially for beginning, don't go too big, because they have a lot of grunt. And if you're using it in the beginning, you go lots of like trying back and forwards and get used to it. But at the moment you're going like, say, OK, I go only downwind. And you can go maybe bigger power wing, mid-size foil, but small board, what makes it so much fun if you have like, it feels like.

Daniel Paronetto (14:31)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (14:53)
Darwin prone or something like that you have this small ball underneath your feet and it's not like this this massive yeah so now that makes you literally yeah yeah yeah now that's pretty cool

Daniel Paronetto (15:00)
That's why we're powering and really.

And when, and when you started, know, you had your five and you had your big board and everything. What was the hardest thing about you understanding how this parawing works? Because you have good kite background, winging background, prone, SUP downwinding. What was the hardest thing to understand?

Sven Mayer (15:23)
Yeah.

The first mistake what I did, there was more mistake, I started pumping, like pumping the ring, to get it looking like this. And that didn't work. On the BRM it didn't work, on the D-Wing it's a different story, but on the BRM it doesn't like that. And you have to understand that definitely. And then also to go back because I...

Daniel Paronetto (15:31)
Mm.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yep.

Sven Mayer (15:52)
You're good at winging, you're coming from down winging, you're a really good drone and whatever. You have to understand you're starting from the beginning. Maybe put some steps backwards. Using bigger foils, bigger boards, you have to understand that to go in this kook phase or like the kook stage again to get used to it. it was really, really hard to understand in the beginning. I remember my first go straight away, bump, went up and I said, oh my God, that's it. Gave it two or three more goes.

Daniel Paronetto (16:09)
Yep, we all have to.

Sven Mayer (16:22)
And I think for small balls, small balls, it just goes straight away. And it just works. So you have to make it still slow. Yeah, but yeah, you have to understand. The first mistake, the biggest mistake was this pumping thing. don't like, especially on the BIM, you have to get the speed pumping more the board than your hands. Like what you normally used from winging, what I normally do from winging when I'm winging. So these small balls are way.

Daniel Paronetto (16:26)
Yeah, I'm a pro.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (16:47)
get the board out of the water and then start like pumping or pumping the backhand to get a little bit movement on the board and then starting the board to pump up and that's what I did actually on the powering to try to get some tensions on the lines and that yeah always you got a little bit then it collapses so yeah it's like not working that good on the the BIM.

Daniel Paronetto (16:49)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, it's interesting because now we're seeing all these brands come out with their pair of wings and their versions of the pair of wings and they are very different. Which ones have you tried?

Sven Mayer (17:18)
So I had the BIMs, then I tried the pocket ring, and I tried now after D-wings.

Daniel Paronetto (17:28)
How was the pocket wing? Did it have a good pull? Really hard.

Sven Mayer (17:30)
really hard. has

a lot of pull, it was a small one, was only a three meter one, but it had a lot of pull, but it was so uncontrolled. I tried it only once, it was all over the place, but I reckon if you get used to it, you can handle it, but it was even, it had a lot of pull, but it was not that much to get me going, it was a pull forward.

Daniel Paronetto (17:53)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (17:53)
But if you're

going forward, you're going this way, then you're losing a lot of pull as well. That was really hard and it was really hard to get it handled with these two handles. So it was, yeah, it was all over the place. But I only tried it for say like half an hour, half an hour, hour or so. That was like really, really, yeah, it was not that, that successful.

Daniel Paronetto (18:06)
I would love to try the pocket wing.

Yeah. So with, yeah, I think it's so interesting. I would love to try the pocket wing still because there is something about the pocket wing now that when I go back and look at it that I really like, it's just the smallest thing ever.

Sven Mayer (18:27)
Yeah, the smallest, yeah. I think they're bringing

out a second version, eh? I think so there's something in the pipeline. Yeah, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (18:32)
I'm sure that would be, I'm

sure that would be, there's been so much progress now in this space that I'm sure they're going to be coming out with something that I think if you're, you know, a pure downwinder foiler and you just want to use it for that, it might actually be the way to go. just for the packability, it's just so small. Yeah. That's cool. So when you, compare, and I think it's impossible not to compare everybody asks me online. think that, and they do ask you as well. Like the.

Sven Mayer (18:49)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yes.

Daniel Paronetto (19:01)
comparing the BRM and the Flow and you've even done a video about that which I think was great. have it's hard, it's there there are different different beasts almost like they Tell us what you think about it. What do you think about the BRM?

Sven Mayer (19:04)
It's really hard to

Yeah,

I think that they both are great wings like they're both out there have this pro and cons. That's like, yeah, the BIM, the best on the BIM, it's really small. Like my six meter BIM is almost the packing size of the 4.2 Flow. That's it's with material. Yeah, but it's.

Daniel Paronetto (19:36)
Yeah, it's a different material.

Sven Mayer (19:43)
But yeah, it has its place. It's definitely really nice. yeah, especially I think it's pretty good if you're starting or if you're using bigger boards, I think so it's pretty cool. The BIM, because it has lots of ground, it forward more. It's easier to pack if you're pulling it back together because the D-Wing sometimes you're pulling it in and it

If you're not used to it, it blows up again. It has like this air bubbles everywhere and it makes it really hard. I think for starting, the BIM is maybe easier and the packing size and the flow. I found the flow is lots of lift upwards. If you put it in a little bit higher, it pulls you actually up. And that's what I prefer because when you're using a small board or like a sinker board, it's really important that you get the board out of the surface and then starting and then...

Daniel Paronetto (20:21)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (20:41)
What I like is that you can do a couple pumps on the ring as well and get the board up because it is like that. I think it's friendlier for using smaller boards. And I think it's maybe more an advanced ring. It's hard to say. I spoke to our other guy before and he found that the D-ring is more a beginner ring or something like that. And I just said, I found it more, it's really hard. There's just so many things.

Daniel Paronetto (20:46)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (21:10)
Because it's also some people say that the D-Wing's flying is more stable than the BRM It's definitely more stable, but if you're back and forwards turning, doing chives, the BRM turns way better than the D-Wing. So it's like all like... Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (21:19)
Mm. Mm-hmm.

Mm. Mm-hmm.

It really depends on what aspect of the parawinging you're looking at, right?

I think when, when you mentioned, if I were to pick the, the, the one that I would recommend to a beginner, I would pick the D wing, because I feel it's just more stable. And if you hold it on the top of the bar or in the middle of the bar or, know, it's fine. The BRM requires you to be a better, it requires better kite control, which I think you instinctively have because of your kiting background. And I've seen people.

Sven Mayer (21:43)
Yeah.

Yeah, that's all the other guys.

Yeah, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (22:03)
that have kiting backgrounds hold the parrowing for the first time and they'll get it in like 30 seconds, they'll be like, cool. And then people who don't have the kiting background, they take a little longer to understand it. So I think maybe for you, the BRM was easier because you're like, well, this is a smaller package, turns a little bit better if I wanna pack it away. But yeah, it depends on how you look at it. I find that if a beginner is starting and they can lean on the parrowing a little more with their hand on the board and.

Sven Mayer (22:09)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (22:32)
not worry

Sven Mayer (22:32)
Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (22:32)
what the parowing is doing so much. It just makes that initial...

Sven Mayer (22:35)
Yeah, that's right.

Definitely. It's super stable, the D-Wing. But the BM is more... It's not unstable, but it's more reactive or something like that. So sensitive.

Daniel Paronetto (22:46)
Yeah, yeah, sensitive I think, yeah. Yeah, I agree, I agree.

What other brands have you heard are coming out with power wings, if any, that you're excited about?

Sven Mayer (22:58)
Definitely off the ozone one because they have lots of backgrounds in parasailing and stuff like that. So I think they put lots of work into it and it must be really interesting. really interested. I'm definitely getting one. Because I want to see it.

Daniel Paronetto (23:00)
Yeah, me too.

Hmm.

Yeah. I have the guys,

the guys that, stock goes in gear, in Torquay Stonker, they, they will bring some of them. I'm definitely going to try them as well. And I agree. If you have a paragliding background, you know how to build a bridal kite and you have so much R and D. I'm excited about the, it should be like a couple of weeks away now. It's not far. It's coming.

Sven Mayer (23:22)
Yeah.

Yeah, I think they did.

coming. We went yesterday to the shop in Friro, the stand up for a shop and they said end of March. I should be on the way. So it's like they should be there pretty soon. So, yeah, really excited.

Daniel Paronetto (23:50)
Yeah, I've been seeing the guys

from Kiting Puerto Rico as well with the North and I've seen clips of them and I'm I'm always looking to see how it flies and how they're, you know, how it reacts and that looks interesting as well. Nash is coming out with them as well in a couple months. So yeah, everybody will launch that. What did you think of that F1 inflatable parrying? Did you see that?

Sven Mayer (23:56)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, everybody will.

Yeah, I saw it, but I don't get the thing because the cool thing is to pack it away. But maybe we're completely wrong. That's what Gong is doing with the longer lines. don't know. So maybe they're doing something that you can't pack away and maybe you can put it in a wind window and it...

Daniel Paronetto (24:29)
Yeah.

Sven Mayer (24:37)
and it drifts better, I don't know. I didn't understand it, maybe we will learn in the future. I don't know. I saw it there. What's the first thing of the thing that could, for me, I only wanted for downwind. That was the most thing that I thought because I struggled with the paddle because of my back and so on. I wanted only for downwind because that's the thing that I'm really happy and I want to pack it easy and stuff like that. And that's what the D-Wing.

Daniel Paronetto (24:39)
I didn't und- I-

Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (25:07)
It's a big wing, but when you're a big guy like me, it's not that big anymore. And if you get, you get actually, there's some technique how you can put it better together and like better pouches and stuff like that. And then it's not too bad. Even I have a 5.5 D-Wing and it's a massive one, but it's not too bad. If you like almost two meters, it's not too big.

Daniel Paronetto (25:12)
Yeah.

Hmm. Yeah.

Yeah, like I,

I went, when we're talking about what, like, what can we, you just spoke about, what is your technique? Okay. So this is where I like to talk a little bit about technique and your, said that if you pack it away in a proper way, it's not that bad. Like what is your stowing technique?

Sven Mayer (25:40)
Yeah.

Yeah,

I normally I shoot out then I turn shoot out to the to the ocean then I turn with the wind turn a little bit to the beach like and then pulling the back lines pulling it all in and then I have this cool clip for the where you put the bar in from from a mate of mine. can have a tea actually.

Daniel Paronetto (26:02)
Mm-hmm.

Is that the one that, I forgot his name,

but he posted on the Instagram group.

Sven Mayer (26:16)
Michael Shepard. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is for. Yeah, I can show it. I have it here. That's the. It's insane. It's like it's the best thing. It's like so and it fits to your life so you can not it in. It's really easy to think and it's a thing from from super cheap auto. You can get it from.

Daniel Paronetto (26:18)
Michael Shepard, yeah shout out to Michael, he did also that awesome, the net, yeah sure, get it to us, because I think just the innovation is like people just doing it. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, I got the same thing. It's like a

$20 thing from super cheap auto to store.

Sven Mayer (26:46)
And it makes it so easy. You

can push, press against it and it's getting smaller and smaller. All the air comes out so it's pretty easy. But yeah, I use this one. It's on my harness belt. then I hook in the bar. You can clip in the bar like that.

Daniel Paronetto (26:58)
Yep, the little clip bar.

Sven Mayer (27:09)
And then I pull the lines in and then I just form a... Look that the lines are always in the powering and then grab it from the outside and push it to my chest to get the most air out of it. And then starting slowly folding it a little bit as well, like folding the sides in and then pressing against and then I start actually it into this little net. And then stuffing it in the side of here.

Daniel Paronetto (27:20)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (27:39)
and

then again I pressing again against it and it's really small. It's like yeah. In the beginning I already start stuffing it in but if you grab the lines from the middle and then get the outside of the power wing also folding like a little bit folding it together and then pressing again and then stuffing it in so that's the and then it works really well. I have to do a video

Daniel Paronetto (27:55)
Yep.

Yeah, I

everybody has this different tech, not different, but they think about it a little bit different. But I think in, in like the essence of it is to have like this core where the lines are and you're just putting things on top of that and trying to keep the lines as, um, tangle free.

Sven Mayer (28:13)
Yeah, The lines here. And if you have this clip,

then your bar doesn't get twisted. all the time I'm pulling it out again. I'm not the guy then to put it out and write again because when I'm stopping normally I have CVed or I've gassed out. But I put out the ring and it's not twisted out. Normally...

Daniel Paronetto (28:22)
Does-

Sven Mayer (28:38)
If I stuffed it all in and had the bars somewhere, normally I put it in the belt or something like, or on the top or something, it always got twisted or sometimes it hangs down and gets flipped around the wing or something like that. So it got always twisted and then I had to untangle it a little bit. But yeah, with the clip, I never had the twist because I clip it in and it's normally, you can't twist it anymore because if you pull lines and you have the lines there, it's, mean, you're folding it together, it's not twisted anymore.

Daniel Paronetto (28:43)
Mmm.

Yeah.

Yeah, interesting.

Sven Mayer (29:07)
You actually can pull it. Michael always did like the deploy it.

Daniel Paronetto (29:08)
Yeah, yeah, that's really good because that's where the...

Yeah, a lot of the problem with packing it down is the, this twist. sometimes just because it's windy, the, the lines start going on the wrong side and you you get lines twisted on the backside of the pair of wings. So I think just man it like the line management and then just making sure that the lines are untwisted is key. Cause then you can redeploy without having to do something with the pair of wings.

Sven Mayer (29:36)
Yeah, yeah, think also if you're pulling it in, the main thing is going with the wind at that moment. You're going with the wind, the wind collapses, pulling the lines in and then yeah, and then normally the wind completely collapses and then yeah, and then I clip it in and I roll it back together.

Daniel Paronetto (29:48)
Mmm.

The one of the things that for me I had to tweak a little bit was the speed that I was going into a bump before I depowered and I was shooting myself too quick and too fast into the bumps. And then because you there's a lot going on and then you you're you're depowered and all of a sudden all you look at is your hands and you're on the wrong place and you end up in a trough and then you just have to start again.

Sven Mayer (30:06)
Yeah.

Yeah

Daniel Paronetto (30:19)
Do you feel it's better to kind of match your speed a little bit then you D power? How do you think about your speed management?

Sven Mayer (30:27)
I normally I go I shoot out turn right into the gun down wind with the wind some more actually going a little bit close turning to the beach so like cross cross wind cross short to the to the shore and then pulling it in and at the moment I pulling it in put the handlebar in the clip then I turn already left don't shoot down the bump and go with the bump and at the moment I turn left

Daniel Paronetto (30:39)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (30:57)
I'm going a little bit like it's like cutting out against the swell, but it takes a little bit of the speed normally. And then I start packing. It's not, you're not breaking, but it's going a little bit slower than and then yeah. then the moment you shoot down, if you're going straight down and then shooting down, there's a lot happening. Yeah. Yeah. Nah, you don't have to do it. Yeah. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (31:01)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah. And also like, you don't have to do it quick, right? I think in the beginning I was so like, I have to pack it in quick, but now I'm like,

I don't care. I just hold it. I have like those 10 seconds of, okay, I know the speed of the bump. I know where I'm at. Then I'm like, all right, let's start packing. And it's just a little bit more calm, not too.

Sven Mayer (31:26)
That's Holy dear.

Yeah. Yeah. There's just

so funny things happened when I was filming actually. was packing, the ring in and then saying, shit, I to ring in. Then I grabbed the camera and I figured out I still have the ring in my hand. I the camera in the other hand so I couldn't pack anymore. I shit, what am doing here? Because there's too much going on. Because you want to do everything. But the main thing, you have to be really relaxed and doing not stressful. And the best is not shooting down bumps, going across bumps.

Daniel Paronetto (31:52)
Too much going on, man. What the?

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (32:03)
it makes it way easier to go out and look for a nice bump, not the biggest one, but a nice bump and maybe what I normally do is I go out and then I see a bump and then I go behind the bump, let me lift up a little bit and then I turn right onto this bump and then I pull it in and then turn straight away left across the bump and then you have lot of time normally, you can serve and hold it in your hand and take your time packing it together and especially if you are

Daniel Paronetto (32:09)
Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm.

Sven Mayer (32:33)
If the bar is solid and everything, it's pretty cool. There you go.

Daniel Paronetto (32:36)
Yeah,

I have to try that clip. That clip looks like a really interesting thing to add onto the gear. you've experienced now a couple of different brands. You're obviously getting some crowdsourced parts and stuff. Where do you think the gear can get better? Like where is the gear lacking right now?

Sven Mayer (32:48)
Yeah.

I think that the power wings, I hope they're getting better and smaller to pack, more powerful, maybe better upwind and stuff like that. yeah, and boards also, finding the right board for me is pretty hard at the moment because it was the same journey when I was winging. When you're heavy, it's really hard to find.

Daniel Paronetto (33:02)
Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (33:19)
boards because there are not many boards they made for your weight or like yeah, or you have to go big boards, but you don't want to go too big. But yeah, it's really you have to compromise. And yeah, I think definitely boards are that hopefully there's more powering boards coming out because what I found out, especially with the Axis board, that's why I'm using the foil drive board because it's super flat and it takes off like so easy. The Sonoma that I had was also pretty flat as well.

Daniel Paronetto (33:24)
Yeah.

Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Hmm.

Sven Mayer (33:47)
but it's even flatter, it's completely flat, takes up easy. The only disadvantage is if you're coming down, touching the water, you have to be prepared and sometimes you go over the handlebars. But it's not too bad, can figure it, if you get used to it, it's not that you know what's happening and then you can say pop up, but the first time it's it grabs the water. It's funny because it releases pretty easy, but if it touches down, it grabs actually, it's really hard to get it released. yeah, but that's it.

Daniel Paronetto (34:02)
Mm.

Mm-hmm.

It's a little sticky.

Sven Mayer (34:16)
It's pretty sticky on the touchdowns, not on the release. the release it's like, this one with the 5'5", 16-70 knots on a big foil, when it's 70 liters, it's like 40 liters less than my weight. It's completely sinking up to my, over my hip, up to my dolly button if I'm putting it down. And 5'5", yeah. And everything, it's around...

Daniel Paronetto (34:19)
Yeah.

That's really good.

Yeah. And you're taking the five five in those conditions? Yeah, the five five parameter.

Sven Mayer (34:44)
20 knots something like that I go for the 4.2 and I can use the 4.2 up to almost I never had 30 knots but I had like 26 27 yeah but I used the BIM in 35 knots it was a lot

Daniel Paronetto (34:53)
Mmm.

Dude, saw

a video, I don't even remember which one it was, but it looked mental. The sea was just white. And it was like, I think you put a bunch of stuff just crazy. Talk to me about that session. Do you know the one I'm talking about?

Sven Mayer (35:11)
Yeah, know. It was funny because my nephew was filming it with the drone and he made this plan because he was flying the drone. And it was a 5K run and I okay, he's flying the drone. And it was hard to get up because it was way too windy. I was sitting, put the wing up and straight away it was on foil, still sitting on the board. It was like, was insane. So it took me a while to get up.

Daniel Paronetto (35:32)
You

Sven Mayer (35:37)
And then he followed me with the drone. It was really, really good. It was insane. It was like around 35 knots. But I hold, it was like solid. It was solid like that. When we had like 30, 35 knots, the bumps getting like higher than me, like two and a half, sometimes like massive, massive bumps. it was like, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (35:43)
That it looked insane.

Yeah, and there was there was a bit of swell as well. wasn't there like the bumps were huge

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (36:04)
It was hard on the BM to shoot out because I hold on to my dear life on the 5 meter. I tried to go a little bit downwind but it was so hard. It was pulling my arms but at the moment I was up it was all good. Then I put it away and it was a sick run. It was one of my best runs definitely. It was lucky that somebody flew the drone actually because I thought the drone was not surviving.

Daniel Paronetto (36:08)
Mmm.

That looked, yeah, I was looking at that, I'm like.

Yeah, you have to be really, because

you can go down with the drone, but then when you're, you know, flying it back up, it doesn't come back to you and you see the battery go.

Sven Mayer (36:34)
He's not flying it back. No, no.

He's not coming back. He flew all the way. The plan was he's flying all the 5Ks and landed with me. Then on the beach. there was a... But it was hard because 5Ks, then the coverage was not that good anymore. High up is good, but if you're going lower, there's no connection anymore. It was really hard, so I had to grab it out of the air. But it was good fun. was really... Yeah, but it was really cool. It was one of the... Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (36:44)
Yeah, that's a good idea. That's a good idea.

Mmm.

Jeez, that's risky. Pushing the limits, Vinny.

Sven Mayer (37:03)
Definitely the best one. And I was lucky that somebody filmed it on the rubber guts. The bumps were insane. I used the Apple Tree, a really small one. think it was also under 70 liters of 3 or 5, 2 Apple Tree ball. that needs a lot of... I need minimum 25 knots to get it going on the BIM. Because it's too short. So think for boards, you need a flat board, a little bit of length.

Daniel Paronetto (37:08)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mmm.

Sven Mayer (37:33)
to get easy going, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (37:33)
Mm-hmm.

mid-lengths are great. Look, I want to talk to you about this as well, because you have a lot of experience now with trying boards and you've tried a few boards and I'm looking to build my next board like just for power winging and you find that a flat bottom is good for the planing and that just getting going.

Sven Mayer (37:35)
Yeah, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (37:55)
lengths and what widths are you looking at at the moment in your head that you feel are good.

Sven Mayer (37:59)
For me definitely like the 5.8 is pretty good. Maybe a 6 a little bit longer, I think the 5.8 is actually it's a perfect number for me for if it's really everything over 20-21 knots and with the smaller powering or with the bigger something like 70 knots. But for light wind to get going maybe around 40 knots, 30-40 knots, I look for like a hundred litre board.

Daniel Paronetto (38:05)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (38:27)
So maybe 10 % less than my weight or same like your weight, something like 10 % less, same like your weight. But around 6, 6, 6 for me, 6, 8 maybe. Yeah, I used the Blast for lighter wind, but it's only a 5.4. It has 95 liters. It gets definitely better in lighter wind than this one, but it would be better this one.

Daniel Paronetto (38:29)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I like those those dimensions

Mm-hmm.

Yeah?

Sven Mayer (38:53)
Say little bit longer, same length maybe or 6'2 or something. But I would say a perfect board, but for me it would be 6'6 and 100 litres or something like that. 20 wide, 21 wide, something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's right.

Daniel Paronetto (38:56)
Mmm.

Yeah, you would get up on anything in that board.

Yeah, I find like I have the, mid length is a 510 18 wide by 85 liters. And I wouldn't mind having it a little bit wider because when it does get 25, 30 knots out there, it gets messy and just the balance on the 18 wide can be tricky sometimes. So I'm thinking for myself, it could be even in that range between a 55 to a 510, 19 and a half.

And 60 to 65 liters. I think that I can get up on pretty much anything with that. I'm just, I'm talking to everyone about this because I want it validated before I go ahead and build it. Cause I want to get it right.

Sven Mayer (39:42)
Yeah. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (39:59)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, spin.

Sven Mayer (40:15)
They say that they're 16 and they're saying that they're pretty, maybe that's the key, but I don't know how they, yeah. But there's also, I think there's something coming because he's into power winging as well and there's something, I heard something.

Daniel Paronetto (40:15)
Yeah.

dude, I've

heard that everybody who's yeah, I've heard something as well. Everybody who had orders placed for the downwind board said, nope, scrap that, get me a pair of winging boards. So I think a lot of the deposits changed, the projects changed. So yeah.

Sven Mayer (40:32)
That's it.

Yeah, so yeah, that's why

it could be that that he figured something out that you go skinnier I don't know but at the moment what we have now and what's in my head I think like the 1920 19 to 21 mark for me is pretty sweet. So yeah

Daniel Paronetto (40:55)
Yeah, yeah, I

agree with that. think, I don't know if power winging needs necessarily the very narrow boards like downwinding and paddling because I actually feel that it's good to feel the power wing fully loaded and a little bit sticky on the water and then you use a very porpoisey pump to get up rather than a speed pump up.

Sven Mayer (41:17)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah,

yeah, not definitely, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (41:22)
And I think that's

why you're having a lot of success as well with those smaller boards. You're having all that power being captured and harnessed there and you're not using the board speed too much to get up. You're using just the power that is in the power wing to pump up. Does that make sense?

Sven Mayer (41:39)
Yeah,

yeah, yeah. But yeah, I had, I used a Sonova Carver 6.2, like the stock one. I think it's also 95 liters. Same like the Blast. It's 6.2 and the Blast is 5.5. And the 6.2 Carver was, I think it's 19 or 20, I think it's 20 wide and it's super unstable. It's really corky. I struggled, like it was horrible.

Daniel Paronetto (41:51)
Mm-hmm. Yep.

Mm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (42:09)
The nose, it's longer than this, the nose got into the water and it was horrible. I couldn't get it up. It was water pushing. I got easier up on the 70 liter, but then on this 95 and over on the stock. It was really funny because yeah, it has lots of rocker. It's way too thick, what I reckon, for powering. It's too corky. And yeah, and then I went to the blast and the blast was so easy and it's way shorter actually.

Daniel Paronetto (42:27)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (42:38)
It's wider, it's a 23 and it didn't make sense in the first time, but it's not that thick, it's way more stable in the water. It's funny, a longer board, I sunk the nose and sunk, it was always water all the time, but the blast is same leader, it's shorter, but it sits on the water. It's really hard, but I think the bottom shade makes a lot of thing and...

Daniel Paronetto (42:39)
Crazy.

Yeah.

Yeah, interesting.

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (43:06)
And I think board and shape, length, not too wide, but also not too skinny and not too thick. I don't think we need thickness. What they have in downwind boards, like lots of downwind boards, they're really thick and like they make it sometimes too cold. I don't know, but yeah, I don't think we need the thickness.

Daniel Paronetto (43:14)
Yeah. Yeah.

No, I hear you, I hear you.

I want to have a little bit more width to distribute the volume a little more and have it thin. I agree. And it'll make a better experience once you're up as well, just being more connected to the foil. What's your favorite conditions to get out there? Like if you were to choose the wind conditions and surf conditions, what do you love to get out on?

Sven Mayer (43:30)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah,

think around everything over like 21 to 25 knots. I like more the stronger winds. The bumps getting bigger and I can use smaller foils and it's getting really skaty. more into... I was lately trying more the fireballs. Fireballs are really good fun. You can turn them still, but I use them only for longer runs. But everything is like 21, 25 knots. I use a Spitfire. It's like a big skate park.

Daniel Paronetto (43:55)
Yeah.

Sven Mayer (44:14)
It's like feeling like a kid in a skate park. It feels so much fun. It's like, it's the best thing, And it's a...

Daniel Paronetto (44:17)
dude, isn't it? I know when you get the

feeling of downwinding on a small board and look, think that's why parawinging is so amazing. Like it allows people like me, I'm not a pro, I'm not a great rider and I would never be able to prone downwind like some people do on a small board, but it gives me the opportunity to do that. And when you're there and then you're doing it, you're like, I have to turn.

Sven Mayer (44:35)
Yeah. Yeah.

difficult to do that. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (44:44)
Like that's the only thing that you can do. Like there's no point in going fast. I'm just like, I have to rip this thing.

Sven Mayer (44:45)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Now that's why I like the Spitfire and like the skated feeling and I think like everything like the 21 knots to 25 knots that then creates really nice. I think around 23 knots it getting really glassy as well the bumps that they're getting really nice shape and it's really cool. like that and it's like the stronger condition I definitely like. I like also light conditions for yeah but

Daniel Paronetto (45:00)
It's perfect. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (45:16)
Well, you actually prefer definitely stronger conditions than that because yeah, definitely.

Daniel Paronetto (45:18)
Preferred. Yeah, I'm not even

using foils that are like super high aspect. I write code and code has the S series and the R series. The R series are like the 13 aspect ratio, the S around the 9.5 and I just have the S series. I have no R series.

Sven Mayer (45:27)
Yeah,

Yeah.

Yeah,

I tried them a lot like when Marcus was still working in the shop there. had them. Yeah, I tried the 850 and it was still a prototype and it was mind-blowing because we tried it on a knee-high as well. And he said, Sven, try it. I said, OK. I said, it's 850. What do you expect? It's like 29 liters of Nova. And I actually connected two waves and I pumped around. I said, it's insane. For that time, was like, fuck.

Daniel Paronetto (45:39)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Wow.

Sven Mayer (46:05)
It blows my mind, say, that's really, it's crazy. It's really good what they created. It's like insane.

Daniel Paronetto (46:07)
They're good, yeah. I will

get into the R series at some point, but like you, I like turning and I'm not really worried about time and speed and I enjoy it sometimes. I like to mix it up, I feel, and some of the boys down here in the coast, I don't know if you know Jared Snow and those guys, they're like absolutely insane. They actually...

Sven Mayer (46:16)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (46:33)
are faster on the S series than the R series because when they're going faster, fully in control and they don't have that feeling of being, know, riding at 80 % or just holding on to something that's just like too fast. And I found it interesting because he did a one minute 45 kilometer on the 720S.

Sven Mayer (46:56)
That's That's some...

Daniel Paronetto (46:57)
like four out dude, it's yeah, now they're insane. How did, how

did para-winging, I know it's just, yeah, they're out of control, those guys. How did para-winging improve your foiling skills?

Sven Mayer (47:06)
What's it say?

Definitely like ocean reading and stuff like that, like this downwind skill to read the ocean, to understand the ocean, to understand the bumps. I did it quite often with the wing as well, but with a wing, you always have the wing in, yeah, it's always in the way. I use now the Y-O and it's actually not too bad. The Y-O flex really nice and I said, my God, it's not too bad, but it's still, you still have something in your hand and it's really hard to read the bumps. Sometimes you can't see them, but yeah, with the power wing.

Daniel Paronetto (47:18)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah.

Sven Mayer (47:41)
I think like understanding the ocean and everything and also this, what you call it, this meditation state when you're out there alone. And that helps me a lot because I'm really active and really I can't sit normally for that long. So yeah, but yeah, it helps me a lot. So that helps me a lot to calm down and also like this, it's it's insane. After every session, I'm so.

Daniel Paronetto (47:49)
Hmm.

You're doing well. We're almost 50 minutes in. You're doing well.

Sven Mayer (48:09)
so relaxed and so happy. It's insane. It's really cool. also like the skatey turns, it helps me a lot. I'm really pleased. We do a lot of towing. We do a lot of towing. we do like, yeah, I get lots of good waves to tow in and stuff like that. But yeah, think that's the main thing is like ocean understanding and stuff like that. So that's pretty cool what I love.

Daniel Paronetto (48:11)
Mmm. Yeah.

Yeah, my turns got improved so much.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Do you take the parowing out in the waves or just downwinding?

Sven Mayer (48:40)
and go with the flow.

just down winning. I tried it once but it wasn't that successful. I tried it on a small board, I think I have to try it on a big board, big foil and then maybe I have more success because then I struggle to get up again. I have to commit to get bigger, bigger, first car and get it sorted. So yeah, I have to get a bit more goals on the race.

Daniel Paronetto (48:55)
Yeah.

Hmm.

Sven Mayer (49:13)
see how it goes. There's this one guy who's rafting in Mauritius. He's riding this big swell on this Mr Powerwing. you see him? What is his name? Dimitri. think it's Mauritius and he's like I can send it to you. He's riding a massive swell like massive on the Powerwing like massive waves and then going back and go again.

Daniel Paronetto (49:19)
Mm-hmm.

With what? With the power wing? no.

Yeah, send it through.

Wow, I definitely want to see that I haven't seen that video I spoke with Cynthia Brown Sinbad and she's a legend in wind sports and she said that came to wild was in Hukipa with a parrowing shredding like killing it on proper eight foot Hawaiian, you know, like I Really want to see that but waves waves is hard man waves is

Sven Mayer (49:41)
It looks pretty cool. Yeah. Yeah.

Oh, Definitely one of few.

Daniel Paronetto (50:08)
Waves is a different thing and, but you, you toe foil a lot and what, what can you, like what tips can you give people like navigating white water and like, can you, can you make any correlations with like people that want to power wing and your experience with toe surfing?

Sven Mayer (50:29)
What you mean like, like, because we were cutting out at the moment, I think that only the half what you said.

Daniel Paronetto (50:36)
Sorry, I'll repeat that. yeah, so there's obviously a lot of people would want to use the parrowing for wave riding. And I noticed that you do a lot of tow surfing. So do you have any tips on how to navigate white water or anything that could help people that want to parrowing in the waves?

Sven Mayer (50:38)
Yeah.

Yeah, definitely. The first thing, don't go too deep. Stay on the shoulder for the first goals and then don't go too deep. don't think you... Because with the powering, you can go like in the right water, can tumble down going in the washing machine and things like that, but nothing that... If you save your head and get a helmet or whatever, you should be safe. With a wing, always got... Your wing gets displaced on your first goal if you're going in the right water. Your foreguts through the wing and then it's gone. But no, powering should be pretty safe.

Daniel Paronetto (51:00)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (51:24)
The best thing is to on the shoulder the first time, play a little bit on the shoulder and then go little bit step by step deeper, to the white water or something like that.

Daniel Paronetto (51:36)
Yeah, how do you navigate the white water when you're toe surfing? Because I find it's horrible.

Sven Mayer (51:41)
You see, normally I normally go pretty deep with the foil. Not too high. At the moment you're going too high, you're in the white water. You have to see that you get under the white water, like still in the green. And like you have to fly. That's why I'm having, normally I have a 90 mass or 100 mass to get like, get it lower in the water, get through the white water and then go out. So if you're going, you can also, you can slide over the white wall, but I'm not that good to get like.

Daniel Paronetto (51:46)
Mm-hmm.

Interesting.

Yeah, nice.

Ugh.

Sven Mayer (52:11)
cuts

through the white water or something. So the best thing is you're going through white water, you're going deep with the foil, go through and then yeah, that works pretty good. Or going in front of white water. That's the other thing. If you're fast enough, go in front and make a big turn around the white water. yeah. Otherwise flying, yeah, not too high. High is like, yeah, it's not that good.

Daniel Paronetto (52:19)
Nice.

It's death.

You mentioned something that I think it's important for us to touch on a little bit, which is using a helmet. What kind of safety gear do you use when you're parowinging?

Sven Mayer (52:43)
When I'm powering I only have my vest. Like this. While I'm checking. And I have this little PLB. That's what I normally use. Because we normally are out 1k sometimes 2k. It's a little bit of safety. Peace of mind what you have. then we... I always have a phone with me as well.

Daniel Paronetto (52:48)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, beautiful.

Yeah, do you take a phone with you or anything like that?

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (53:12)
And

what we normally do is we have a WhatsApp group and we share the location for eight hours. Everybody shares the location. they're back on the beach, then they stop. That's what we do. And that helps a lot because you see, even if you want to do a second run, it helps because you see the guys far behind or whatever. So we can do a second one or something like that. Also, yeah, it helps a lot. And you know where everybody is. And yeah, that's pretty cool. then I have a...

Daniel Paronetto (53:20)
Yeah, nice. We do the same here.

Yeah, or if you're

at work, could just swear at them because they're having fun and you're just at work.

Sven Mayer (53:42)
Yeah, the

phone thing like... So yeah. Nah, that's pretty cool. Yeah, and then I have a helmet.

Daniel Paronetto (53:47)
I'm like bastards to getting out there.

Have you ever, have

you been in like a, yeah, the helmet? Yeah. Did you use a soft helmet?

Sven Mayer (53:54)
I use

the soft helmet but not much for downwinding. use it more for when we tow in. For downwind I normally have a bucket head or something like that. I have the soft surfboard helmet from DMC fins.

Daniel Paronetto (54:03)
Yep.

Which soft helmet do you use?

yeah, okay, because I yeah, I tried a few I'm not really I like the ones that leave my ear exposed because I don't like anything covering my ear. I struggle to balance or like I don't like anything muffling.

Sven Mayer (54:18)
Yeah, the one, yeah.

Okay.

okay, I like

that the soft, they go over the ears, but I like it because they don't fill up with water. And they keep you really warm in winter, especially when you're on the ski or something like that, when it's cold. And they this nice flap as well for your back, that you then get sunburn. And I find they sit perfectly. If you have to duck dive, normally like other helmets, they fill up with water. And then, yeah, it's like, I hate it. That's why I like the soft helmet.

Daniel Paronetto (54:34)
Yep.

Mmm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (54:56)
They're pretty good. If you hit the foil, it works pretty good. Board doesn't matter. you have to be careful especially if it goes around here. I got some guys that got some cuts here. Otherwise they work really, really, really good. I have other guys that use actually did... He showed me that actually it was two days ago. He has like a fluoro-rushy which is cut-proof and a board-short which is cut-proof. I googled it it's only gong.

Daniel Paronetto (55:05)
Yeah.

god.

Have you?

Wow.

Sven Mayer (55:25)
is doing that. think that maybe they had a patent or I don't know but it's pretty handy because you imagine you fall into the foil and you have actually your board shot is cut proof. It's perfect or your shot it's really good. think that's more companies have to look into that because it's like yeah I don't know if they have patent on it or I don't know because it's I never saw it from other brands because I checked it and that after it's rushy it's a fluoro rushy and a black pant where it's completely cut proof. So if you fall with the foil it's

Daniel Paronetto (55:36)
That's awesome.

Yeah.

I'll look into that. I'm

actually going to make a note. That's a cool one. Gongrashi.

Sven Mayer (55:55)
That's pretty cool. Yeah, that's girl like that. Yeah.

That's pretty... I spoke to actually, had like two days ago, spoke to this guy and he said, yeah, that's from Gorman's. that's pretty cool. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (56:08)
Has anything really gnarly happened to you out there, parawinging, that was dangerous?

Sven Mayer (56:13)
I was powering nothing. I always thought about maybe if your lines getting twisted around on the board, yeah, but not on the power wing. Because I don't see that, I don't know why. I don't know because if it's flying away, I'm thinking sometimes maybe it sinks, I don't know. If it's too long in the water, maybe the power wing sinks, but it's not flying away.

Daniel Paronetto (56:18)
Do you wear a leash or anything like that?

Hmm. yeah. Like I see some people with the, with the leash on the parrowing and yeah.

But look, it takes a lot of time to sync.

Sven Mayer (56:42)
Yeah, that's why I think about it, but it's flying away. That's why I think it's definitely stopping. That's why I don't think, must get sometimes it didn't happen with the dealing. It happened with the BIM when I untangled it, especially in like high winds and it's over 25 knots and you have a big tangle. And I didn't use that clip from Michael before and it was a big tangle. And I tried to untangle it, that your finger gets twisted around the lines and then the...

Daniel Paronetto (56:43)
Yeah. No.

Hmm.

Mm.

Sven Mayer (57:10)
That's the only thing that I think maybe could happen. That you get like losing a few, I don't know because that's really dangerous. But otherwise on the powering it's really hard that something it's like, yeah, I don't know.

Daniel Paronetto (57:14)
Yeah, that's dangerous.

Yeah, I

feel there's, mean, obviously if you're in like 30 knots, it's an issue. the there there's been people that had been declawed with the kite, like a normal kite that they get there. But that has so much more energy than the power wing to do that. the power wing can still hurt you, but I think to do a proper like declaw, I don't know. Like you have to be in super overpowered conditions, but,

Sven Mayer (57:32)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely.

That's it. Yeah.

Yeah, that's why

I think I don't even hear overpower. Yeah, that one day when I was overpowered and you have to tie it up and you're trying to get on your board and so much power and it lifts you up all the time, you have to be careful with the foil because you're shooting up like a rocket. I was sitting on the board and it lifted me like a meter or one and a half meter off the board. I'm 110 kilos, it was insane. I was sitting holding with both hands and it lifted me from the board. I said, what's going on? That's a little bit there, but it's only if it's like really, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (57:56)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (58:15)
lot of wind but otherwise I had way more dangerous calls like pedaling like hitting the pedal falling into the foil or something like that yeah or down a lot of

Daniel Paronetto (58:21)
Mm-hmm. Mm. I fell into the Parawing

once, and it wrapped around my face like an octopus in the water. So weird.

Sven Mayer (58:30)
yeah, that's really, I think that's awesome. We

have to be careful. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (58:37)
Yeah. And just, just getting caught in the parrowing. Like if you're in the water and the pairings around you slowly, the line start to tangle around your foot. when you look at it, you're just like, you're inside the parrowing. it's, yeah, it's good to keep it far and like at a distance as much as possible. And what's a, what's a good safety, safety tip or safety advice for people that's starting out.

Sven Mayer (58:49)
Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

to starting out, definitely use a life jacket, definitely, maybe use a helmet and yeah, I don't know. if you're falling, I had this close call also falling into the powering ones, but it didn't get wrapped off on my face because yeah, but it normally happens when you're pulling it in, You pull the kite in, you're going downwind and then you're shooting down. So yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (59:20)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (59:30)
Normally, what I normally do is try to hold it in one hand or something like that and throw it away or something like that. Don't hold to your cut, things like that. So if you're holding it, not packing it away, maybe throw it away when you're falling or something like that. It's better than holding into it and fall. I just only fall onto it because it was already packed, but I imagine if you're pulling it in and at the moment you're pulling it in, maybe it's blowed up a little bit and you're falling forward, you fall straight with your face into it and it's like, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (59:38)
Yeah.

That's a good tip.

Sven Mayer (1:00:00)
So maybe pull it in more to the side or something like that and maybe get it fast packed together like that you have it in your hand and if you're falling you can throw it away or something like that. That's better because if you're falling with your face into it it's like...

Daniel Paronetto (1:00:12)
Yeah, I think we're also learning

how, even learning how to fall with it, I think is important. Like when you're winging, you learn how to fall with the wing where you're you know, damaging your wing or anything like that. It will be the same with the parrowing, maybe have the parrowing a little bit further away from you. I think that's a good tip. And are there any spots that you want to explore with the parrowing that you haven't gone to yet?

Sven Mayer (1:00:15)
you

Yeah.

Definitely there are many but if I'm telling them then I'm getting in trouble again. I'm always getting in trouble when I'm posting videos or something like that. not the logist, always say what are you doing? There are many many spots there. Definitely I want to do like long downwinders. I did one long downwinder with the wing. I think it's now three, three and half years ago from Mandra to...

Daniel Paronetto (1:00:58)
Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (1:01:04)
to

Daniel Paronetto (1:01:15)
massive yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (1:01:34)
I had to find something where I can try it and yeah. But yeah, that's definitely what I, I definitely this wave thing I think I'm not sold yet on that, but I think on the perfect spot, it's a lot of fun, definitely. But for our conditions here at the moment, there's not much happening. So yeah, but yeah, I think.

Daniel Paronetto (1:01:38)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, I'm sure.

Yeah. What's Perth

like throughout the year? What's the good time to go to Perth for downwinding?

Sven Mayer (1:02:00)
For downriding, all the summer time, starting from late October, beginning of November, it ends now, or something like that. And it's like epic conditions. The only thing that we have, have seaweed sometimes. If you're a westerly wind in, it pushes the seaweed in, or if you get like a storm, it loses all the seaweed. Like this year, we had lots of summer swell. Normally in summer, we don't have any swell.

Daniel Paronetto (1:02:09)
Yeah.

Sven Mayer (1:02:26)
a weed of 50 or something like that that's big. But we had like lots of big swells, like two meter. had last week we went towing and it was like solid overhead for me. like was like for summer, it's unbelievable. But that rips all off the seaweed. And then the next day, it's like lots of weed. And if we have a westerly wind as well, then it puts in this time. Then we had lots of weeds. So yeah, that's the only downside I Perth and everybody's complaining.

Daniel Paronetto (1:02:27)
Mm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (1:02:54)
about the reed. was really bad this year, but last year was not too bad. It depends. think because we had lots of like big swells, summer swells, so we normally don't have much swell in summer, more in winter, to speak. I want to see how.

Daniel Paronetto (1:03:02)
Mmm.

Do you have

a technique to get rid of weed? Like some guys that are just like popping their foils out of the water and stuff like that.

Sven Mayer (1:03:14)
Yeah, I tip reach with some folks like the fiber, so easy can tip reach and then you can get rid of maybe the ones on the tip a little bit. I don't know, there's many people asking me about footsteps on power winging, if this is a go. I'm not into jumping anymore because of my back. Maybe, that's what I normally did on the wing. I always jumped quickly and got rid of the weed and I think maybe that's like,

Daniel Paronetto (1:03:20)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Hmm.

Sven Mayer (1:03:39)
Even the guys now downwind paddling style, you Mitchell, I don't know if you know him. There was Donny doing the backflip, he told me yesterday he got rid of the It's just chub to get rid of the weed. So yeah, think that has more coming 100%. You can't jump boards without footstep as well. it's like, yeah, there's definitely.

Daniel Paronetto (1:03:44)
Crazy. Doing a backflip. my god.

Hmm.

Sven Mayer (1:04:07)
I think we have to train more here in Perth

Daniel Paronetto (1:04:13)
Yeah, I'm keen

to put some straps on. I'm keen to put some straps on and like, you know, what Boz Mueller is doing and all those things. I think there's so much fun to be had in freestyle. I'm obviously not going to be doing backflips or anytime soon, but even just, you know, a pop three or something like that and doing more kind of wake style tricks. Like I, there's so much to grow. Like where do you think the Parawing will go this year? Like I think 2025 will be.

Sven Mayer (1:04:16)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, different. Yeah.

Yeah. Definitely. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (1:04:42)
crazy for power winging.

Sven Mayer (1:04:43)
I think definitely more downwind, think it will kick off because I see how many people went into downwind this year paddling and I think way more getting into it now with the parawing because they think it's maybe an easier start to get into downwinding. Definitely that. And then if you see the guys like Bals, if they're putting up videos on Instagram like that, there's more coming like this freestyle stuff and like backflips, double backflips, I don't know.

Daniel Paronetto (1:04:51)
Hmm.

Sven Mayer (1:05:10)
I don't

Daniel Paronetto (1:05:10)
Double we're talking about doubles already

Sven Mayer (1:05:13)
know, there's lots of stuff coming in there. think it's pretty new now. It's like the... what is it? The pocket thing is two years now or something like that? Or one and a half years? Two years, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So that's why. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (1:05:25)
The Pocketwing is probably two years. The BRM launched what September 24th. That's when I ordered mine and it took like a month to get here. I got it around late October or something like

that and I started in yeah, sometime around there.

Sven Mayer (1:05:38)
But it's like,

but it's like, it's.

Daniel Paronetto (1:05:41)
Yeah, I think that there's going to start to have, I think, I think for 2025, everybody will, I honestly, I think that 20 to 30 % of wingers will own a parowing by the end of this year. And that, that number will double, um, the following year. Um, because it's a great compliment for your quiver, you know, for traveling, it's incredible. You could travel with three pair of wings and a mid length. You're done. You're done. You can get out in any condition.

Sven Mayer (1:05:57)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, definitely. Yeah, especially traveling. It's easy. Yeah, yeah, no,

And if the bigger brands jumping on it, I think that's the main thing because now it was BRM. Nobody heard about like the most of the wingers never heard about BRM. I think so. Maybe the guys they were kiting before, but yeah, they were a little bit skeptic then.

Daniel Paronetto (1:06:16)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sven Mayer (1:06:25)
The D-Wing, it looks cool but if the big brands like Nash, Ozone, Norse, all the guys that they're having wings from, they're jumping on it, it's getting big. Everybody's definitely buying one. Maybe it puts the price a little bit down, I don't know because it was like hefty with the first ones but it was every cent, 100%.

Daniel Paronetto (1:06:30)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah, it's coming.

Yeah, I copped that BRM and I'm like, I'm paying full price, tax, shipping, everything. And I'm like...

Sven Mayer (1:06:51)
Yeah, same me. Same me. said

I believe. But I said I paid because I wanted and it looks so good. was every cent, every cent. That's why I bought a six as well afterwards. It was every cent. that. Like that.

Daniel Paronetto (1:07:04)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

I agree. was, and I admire like everything that Greg's done, like being like not a big brand, putting all his money into it and launching this thing. I think it's like, you do have to reward that first mover, you know, like there's so much time and effort that goes into it.

Sven Mayer (1:07:23)
Yeah. And the customer,

I have to say the customer service is top notch because I, funny story. Yeah, yeah. Not me, my wife broke it. It's very funny. Normally I break everything. didn't think everybody noticed. But yeah, I, the BIM, in the beginning it's really hard to dry out. So I hanged it normally in the garage.

Daniel Paronetto (1:07:28)
Yeah.

What did you break? What did you break?

Sven Mayer (1:07:50)
and then I put it down in the garage and laid it down in the garage to dry it and my wife came back with the car and she didn't see it and she drove over it and she ran over the bar and the bar cracked and I said oh no and I straight away texted Greg and said oh my wife drove over the bar no worries I send you a new one after five days he sent it express after five days the bar was there I was sick it was like shit it was like because I couldn't use it because it was already

Daniel Paronetto (1:07:57)
she ran over it.

That's awesome. That's awesome.

Sven Mayer (1:08:19)
Yeah, it was cracked about five days. It was insane. was. It's really good. then I had one yard on the five that the bar got on the side. It got a little bit like broke, not broke like the bridles. is, yeah, they got because the BIM is not like a Velcro thing, but they saw it on the side and they sometimes break.

Daniel Paronetto (1:08:21)
That is so cool to hear, man. Like that responsiveness.

Mm-hmm.

afraid?

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Sven Mayer (1:08:48)
then you can see the carbon bar out. They just released a new bar and he sent a new bar now. It's it's insane. have now a bar with Velcro and things like that. So it's it's pretty cool. Like the customer service is insane and the communication for such a small brand like it's really good. It's really good. Yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (1:08:49)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, that's so cool, man.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Look, if you're listening to this or if you're ever listening to this, Greg, awesome work, man. Thanks for everything. Because his launch just catapulted everything. It just changed everything.

Sven Mayer (1:09:12)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah,

definitely, At first, that was like insane. Yeah, it was worth every penny.

Daniel Paronetto (1:09:24)
Yeah.

And the other thing I feel might be a trend for this year is once all these pair wings are out, I think there will be like a down-winding model, the freestyle model. and they will start having little differences between each other for stability. Like to me right now, I don't care about stability. I would rather the smallest, most packable thing.

But now I have all the flow, I'm going to just like, I'm not going to be changing. I would rather buy a new like ozone to try it rather than going back, but material, thickness, all that stuff. Like I think they will start to, to be very different. Like I would, I would love a two meter super thin minimal bridles just to get out for down winding. And then I would use another one if I'm doing an upwinder or like if I want to do freestyle.

Sven Mayer (1:09:50)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, think something because like Gong is already doing like the stream models and doing like the what they have like a freestyle downwind model, but you can easily pack and stuff like that. So and I don't know. I have to try it. have no idea. I would love to try it. How it works. yeah, but yeah, I quite often I use two rings. If the wind is not up, really, I use the five and a half.

Daniel Paronetto (1:10:19)
We'll see.

The double skin, what do you think about the double skin stuff?

Yeah, same.

Sven Mayer (1:10:48)
put the 4.2 in the backpack and yeah, it doesn't bother me, the little backpack on the back. It's so good using two wings like that. And you always can finish your session. yeah, it's pretty cool. So that's all.

Daniel Paronetto (1:10:49)
Same.

Yeah.

Yeah, I do that a lot now because I like,

yeah, on days that you can't really get a shuttle or whatever, I just put one in my belt, a bigger or smaller size, whatever I think the wind will do. And then I, if I'm doing short runs, I don't really pack it in. I just hold it in my hand and ride it. And I think I get better deploys and you know, better success that way. And then I always have a second pair of wing if conditions change.

Sven Mayer (1:11:21)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, that's really good. That's what I think if you have to maybe want, you can go upwind really good. You shoot upwind for 5kms, take it away, get the other one, but you get the only out of the water, which is easy packable and then go up something like that. Or even what I said to the peder guys, lots of peder guys asked me about the parking and I think it's also good for the peder guys as a safety feature.

Daniel Paronetto (1:11:49)
Mm.

Yeah, yeah, 100%.

Sven Mayer (1:11:54)
If the pedal breaks

or something like that, like so many guys, they to pedal breaks, have to swap pedals or something like that. But if you're going alone or you have to pedal or getting out to a break, they don't have to pedal out like a K. They're getting the power in, getting out, pack the power in and start pedaling. Because there's some spots they have to pedal like out one, two Ks. They can use the power in to get out. There's so many options. So yeah, I think that's just there.

Daniel Paronetto (1:12:05)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

There's a lot, the boys in

the coast, they're like hardcore downwinders on the paddle. just like, they do two, three downwinders every day. And they, there's no rest day anymore because if it's a bit on shore, they'll go out, like you said, a couple of Ks, which will give them a good angle that they don't have to like just peel right or peel left all the time. And then they just start their run, you know, two kilometers, three kilometers into the ocean. And then they have a perfect angle.

Sven Mayer (1:12:24)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's pretty cool.

Daniel Paronetto (1:12:45)
Cool, Svenny. Look, awesome chat, man. think, you know, just meeting you online just because you froth on the parrowing and I'm just all over the parrowing as well. And now getting to meet you through this call has been awesome. And thank you for accepting the invitation as well to come and chat. You had no idea what this was. But yeah, dude, I think, look, I just want to put as much information out there as possible. I think.

Sven Mayer (1:12:53)
Yeah

No, thank you for having me. No, thank you for having me. Pretty stoked.

Daniel Paronetto (1:13:14)
It's so new. Nobody knows anything about this. Everybody's exploring in their own little niches. So if we just have a place that everybody can congregate and put everything online, that, Facebook group that we're all in, think it's parrowing for parrowing and foiling, something like that. You'll find it if you look for it is great. so thank you very much for coming to the podcast. Keep ripping. If I go to WA, I'm going to hit you up. Cause.

I would love to get out with and just, just like, yeah, just explore power winging with you guys down there. You guys have a really cool, community in, in Perth. Like it seems like everyone's so friendly, so cool and awesome foilers. Like everybody rips. It's awesome.

Sven Mayer (1:13:44)
Definitely let me know.

Yeah, definitely hit us up.

Yeah, but

yeah, they're really good and like a massive crew. It's getting bigger and bigger. think like one of the works of course over a hundred people now. It's insane. It's like it's going to be good. Yeah, yesterday was really, really lots of traffic actually out there. There was a peddler. Yeah, I tried. I really funny. I tried yesterday a four drive. The first time like I said, I have to get like I want to try it like this. I've tried a max and I thought that's

Daniel Paronetto (1:14:16)
It was it. Getting a little busy.

Sven Mayer (1:14:30)
It was not my thing, but I tried to swim and it was pretty funny. So I was out with other guys on a four-wheel drive. So I was three guys on four-wheel drive. Then really the prone guy, he's also really good as he did this long downwind I think you saw during this massive downwind from Baselton to yeah. And he was all on a prone with the other guy on a prone and there some stand up paddlers coming past. was like getting busy now. That's like, yeah.

Daniel Paronetto (1:14:54)
That's crazy, that's like Hood Riverbaze- busy.

Sven Mayer (1:14:57)
It was really cool,

yes there was not much wind, was like 14-15 knots but it was really cool to see everybody out there playing around. It was really cool.

Daniel Paronetto (1:15:04)
Look,

if you ever come to Melbourne as well, shoot me message and we'll hang out and show you the spots and get some sessions in.

Sven Mayer (1:15:10)
Yeah, definitely. Yeah.

Awesome. Cool. Cool. Yeah. Will do. Yeah, you too. Yeah, same. Have a good one. See ya. Bye.

Daniel Paronetto (1:15:17)
All right, man. Thank you for your time. Keep parowinging and we'll keep pushing it, man. Good to talk to you.

006_Sven Mayer: Is Parawinging possible for riders over 100kgs???

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